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SilverDolly51
Joined: Sep 17, 2005
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 Posted:
Nov 09, 2009 - 01:54 PM |
 
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I love those ugly british planes! 
Gotta love the Boulton Paul Defiant turret style, too!  |
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Po
Joined: Sep 14, 2007
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Location: Wiltshire, United Kingdom
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Nov 09, 2009 - 02:16 PM |
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I think both are bloody well gorgeous.
Well its also not just an turret styled like an Boulton Paul turret it actually is one. I also love how you can see the spin parachutes rip chord going along the Roc's fueslage from just under the pilot to the tail. Also love how the canopy between the pilot and turret and the sticking up part at the top of the rear fuselage behind the turret could be raised to reduce drag and then lowered when the guns had to be used. Also the pilot even though having no fixed guns himself still had an trigger on his spade grip as the turret could be fixed forward and fired by him. |
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M_Sabata
Joined: Mar 31, 2008
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Nov 09, 2009 - 08:45 PM |
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I like the fixed turret idea... very cool... |
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Caveman
Joined: Aug 26, 2006
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Nov 10, 2009 - 05:51 AM |
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That sounds terrifying! It would be like being shot at, having bullets whipping by past your head. I wonder how they managed the interrupter gearing for that! |
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Bat
Joined: Jun 22, 2007
Posts: 185
Location: Belgium
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Nov 10, 2009 - 01:51 PM |
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| SilverDolly51 wrote: | I love those ugly british planes!
Gotta love the Boulton Paul Defiant turret style, too! |
Yeah!
That's what's really desappointing with british plane-designers. It's hard to believe that the same country poduced the Blackburn Skua AND the Spitfire, the Hampden AND the Mosquito, the Bristol Brigand AND the tempest, and so on! No golden mean! Just ugliests and prettiests planes in aviation history (no less)!  Look for example to USAAF or Luftwaffe: sure, they had some missed planes, but on an aesthetic point of view, most are close of a "general mean". For british planes, looks like it's just the opposite! |
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Po
Joined: Sep 14, 2007
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Nov 10, 2009 - 02:55 PM |
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I had not thought about that the bullets would have to go through the airscrew Caveman. I assume maybe it did have an interupter gear also then should it have to be fired forward. Boulton Paul turrets and others did have interupter gears themselves in order to stop the gun firing when the guns would be aiming at the tail and such. Fixed turret idea is I think just an modification that could be made whilst on the ground by the way Sabata not an flick an switch there pilot has control whilst in the air sorta affair.
Bah Bat... Nonsense... |
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peril
Joined: Aug 03, 2003
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Nov 10, 2009 - 03:09 PM |
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M_Sabata
Joined: Mar 31, 2008
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Nov 10, 2009 - 06:32 PM |
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Maybe it's just that other countries either made good or mediocre planes, while the RAF had good or just BAD planes  |
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SilverDolly51
Joined: Sep 17, 2005
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Nov 11, 2009 - 04:52 AM |
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And the few good planes they produced became world famous...
'oh my god, those brits FINALLY made something airworthy *utter shock*  '
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peril
Joined: Aug 03, 2003
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Nov 11, 2009 - 05:14 AM |
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And the Japanese? Leaders in their field in 1940, good designers as well, just peaked a bit early |
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Bomber
Joined: May 28, 2004
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Nov 11, 2009 - 05:15 AM |
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Could it be, and I know it's a wild guess here... that the RAF were playing 'catch-up' in the arms build-up or once the war started, had the the thought that asthetic considerations were secondary to killing Germans ?
Good enough is good enough
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Stiglr
Joined: Aug 03, 2003
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Nov 11, 2009 - 11:39 AM |
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Good enough, however, was also Blenheims, Battles, Beauforts and other truly wretched planes.... |
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rigamortis
Joined: Oct 11, 2009
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Nov 11, 2009 - 03:09 PM |
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It mirrors their car design almost perfectly LOL. You get some very beautiful cars and some totally crap ones. There was actually a Bristol Blenheim car and take a look at the Standard Vanguard phase II. I can remember the 3-wheel cars running around Yorkshire as a kid too. |
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Po
Joined: Sep 14, 2007
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Nov 11, 2009 - 03:53 PM |
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I don't think any British machines used in World War Two are ugly really. I think they are all either bloody gorgeous or average. Alright the Handley Page Hampden does look somewhat odd in some pictures but in others it looks rather nice. It makes me think it looks like an cross between an Armstrong Whitworth Whitley (tail) and an Bristol Beaufort (turret and forward) even though really it's tail doesn't look that much like an Whitleys.
Although I possibly have an rather warped and biased view on them. My way in being patriotic rather than rootin us in sports. |
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Stiglr
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Nov 11, 2009 - 04:52 PM |
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Hampden would be nice to have for early war, wouldn't it?
Riga, you're looking for a subject for your first efforts, aren't you? Well, then..... |
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Bomber
Joined: May 28, 2004
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Nov 11, 2009 - 05:00 PM |
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Hollywood
Pretty rather than practical.
The M16 rather than the ak47
Maybe if the US had had an ugly gun they'd not have lost in Veitnam..
Thankfully the RAF chose the Lancaster rather than the B17, or there'd have been no free Britain from which to stage an invasion once the US had decided to join in. |
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Stiglr
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Nov 11, 2009 - 07:28 PM |
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Well, certainly nobody's suggesting Lancs were ugly.... |
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M_Sabata
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Nov 11, 2009 - 10:47 PM |
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To me, it seems that Japanese aircraft designers got stuck up, and couldn't recover once the US caught up (same sort of thing for germany no? They were kinda using the same planes throughout the war). Actually, the US started the war stuck up, but they could afford to pay for it... so don't get stuck up
Late war JP planes were pretty good all-around, they just lost quality as the bombs started falling. |
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mekgp
Joined: Mar 14, 2004
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| Posted:
Nov 11, 2009 - 11:12 PM |
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OH bloody hell... 
Second topic: Hampden? why, its a cross between a Beau and a Do17! |
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Po
Joined: Sep 14, 2007
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Nov 12, 2009 - 10:06 AM |
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| Simon wrote: | Hollywood
Pretty rather than practical.
The M16 rather than the ak47
Maybe if the US had had an ugly gun they'd not have lost in Veitnam..
Thankfully the RAF chose the Lancaster rather than the B17, or there'd have been no free Britain from which to stage an invasion once the US had decided to join in. |
I rather don't believe the M16 was the sole reason in the failure in Vietnam. Various reasons. Would have been won with Aussies only I reckon only had the Aussie public been not against the war either.
Also Avro Lancasters starting coming into units in 1942 I believe? So I think it could claim to being an machine which ensured that Germany did not get back to strength and manage to start to think about attempting another invasion but in helping to stop the first invasion belongs to the Spitfires, Hurricanes, Defiants, Blenheims, Hampdens, Whitleys, Gladiators, Skuas, Rocs, Wellingtons, Swordfishs, Beauforts, Battles, Manchesters and such. |
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SilverDolly51
Joined: Sep 17, 2005
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| Posted:
Nov 12, 2009 - 01:33 PM |
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I agree with Bomber, effectiveness comes before estethics. But even then, there are some really weird british planes that, aerodynamically, don't make any sence.
But because they are ugly, I kind of like 'em too. I mean, take that Hampdon for instance... If I would be a crewmember, I would be really really proud of it. it's a bit of an underdog position.
These are some of my favourite (lesser known) british planes (some being quite odd):
And my absolute favourite:
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Po
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| Posted:
Nov 12, 2009 - 01:49 PM |
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Bat
Joined: Jun 22, 2007
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| Posted:
Nov 12, 2009 - 02:25 PM |
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I always found the DH Sea Hornet a really well-designed plane if we consider the aesthetic question!
A French comics artist, Francis Bergèse, who adaptated in comic strips the adventudes of Bigglesworth (due to W.E. Johns) was inspired by it for an wonderful RAF fictionnal prototype, successor of the Mosquito: the "Spur", purchasing another fictionnal protoypes: the german "Renkell".
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SilverDolly51
Joined: Sep 17, 2005
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| Posted:
Nov 12, 2009 - 03:37 PM |
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hehe Po... a connaiseur too
@ Bat: I love Bergèse's comics! The way he can draw an aeroplane!  WOOF! |
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lumino
Joined: Mar 29, 2006
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| Posted:
Nov 16, 2009 - 05:41 PM |
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| SilverDolly51 wrote: |
These are some of my favourite (lesser known) british planes (some being quite odd):
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the whirlwind reminds me of another plane with a heavy nose armament...
| SilverDolly51 wrote: |
And my absolute favourite:
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aerodynamic principles are the same for every country:
 |
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